Atheistic religions

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Atheistic religions

Postby BunniRabbi » Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:34 pm

I'm doing research to add an article on atheistic religions. It helps readers be more conversant on the subject of atheism, by clearing up misconceptions about the term 'atheist'.

I want to create a comprehensive list, or as near as I can, of religions which are atheistic as a default or have some significant variant which is atheistic. Also, I'm looking to include any religions where atheism is an option. I'd like to have at least a few paragraphs on each entry, so if anyone has any good reference sites they can contribute, or any religions you think should be added to the list, please let me know.

Here's the current list:

Nontheist Quakers
Atheist (Nirisvaravada) Hindus
Religious Positivists
Raelians
Pearlists (I like to find some strong confirmation of this)
Unitarian Universalists
Buddhists
Episcopalians (there's supposedly a sub-set which is atheistic, though I haven't confirmed this)
Jains
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Postby BunniRabbi » Thu Mar 17, 2011 3:27 pm

So no additions, corrections, questions, etc?

How about anyone looking to help write a section?
If they tell you there is no such thing as truth, ask them if that statement is true or false.
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What's atheism and religious mean here?

Postby dobbie » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:42 pm

BunniRabbi asked
So no additions, corrections, questions, etc?

Only that the terms atheism and religion are the stumbling block.

For example how anybody can become an atheist Buddhist Christian sounds like a contradiction in terms. Athesitc means no gods for whatever reason. Christian means subscribing to New Testament monotheism.

It's just a definition thing, but it forever causes confusion anyway. I don't see any way around it, except by clearly naming certain Buddhists only, as well as certain Christians only. And confining a discussion to those.
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Your List is Objectionable

Postby McIago » Fri Mar 18, 2011 10:51 pm

As a Unitarian, I can state categorically, that nobody can state categorically that all or even most Unitarians, Universalists or Unitarian-Universalists are atheists.

My brother, a born again Christian, says that I am an athiest because my views are different from his. These churches are an outgrowth of Congregationalism, so each congregation decides on the beliefs and on calling a minister [if any].

I know many Friends [Quakers] and there are three major types of congregation. In general a congregation awaits the guiding light, or holy spirit, or inspiration to motivate a member to stand and speak. If they are atheist how do you explain this?

Your list shows lack of knowledge and with respect to these particular churches seems to be propaganda aimed at those whose views and practices differ from your own. IMHO this is "unChristian." It is also unscientific, for those who are not into religion.

As to my own belief system, I do not believe in a personal god, am more likely to, if pressed, state that the force of nature is god.
I am, therefore I think.
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Re: Your List is Objectionable

Postby BunniRabbi » Tue Mar 22, 2011 11:04 pm

dobbie> There are those who would argue one could be Christian and atheist, though there a distinct minority. Religion is a set of customs, practices and ideas though, so it's not completely contradictory.

You have pointed out that the entry under 'religion' on the Iron Chariots wiki could use clarification on this point, however.

McIago wrote:As a Unitarian, I can state categorically, that nobody can state categorically that all or even most Unitarians, Universalists or Unitarian-Universalists are atheists.


As a Unitarian Universalist, I hope you don't think I meant to say that all Unitarian Universalists are atheists. It would be right to say that most Unitarian Universalists are however, according to the census taken by the UUA in 2010 (as reported in UU World magazine). As to a the matter of addressing your response categorically, keep in mind that when I say 'atheist' in this case, I am referring to both positivist and non-positivist (weak and strong) atheism. As a category, this means that I am including agnostics in that count, as per the definitions used on the Iron Chariots wiki.

McIago wrote:I know many Friends [Quakers] and there are three major types of congregation. In general a congregation awaits the guiding light, or holy spirit, or inspiration to motivate a member to stand and speak. If they are atheist how do you explain this?


You would be referring to theistic Quakers there I assume? I specified Non-theist Quakers. As to how a non-theist Quaker would answer that question, I don't know, but by the time I finish this project I hope to.

McIago wrote:Your list shows lack of knowledge and with respect to these particular churches ...


Well, yes. I know only a little about most of them. That's part of why I'm setting out to find out more. It also seems that having that same knowledge would be useful to this community.


McIago wrote: ... seems to be propaganda...

I think you have misread my intent. The only statement I've meant to make about each of these faiths is that it is possible to be an atheist and follow them under at least one well established interpretation. If you feel that this is in error, please make a specific statement as to why, preferably with a reference I can use to substantiate the claim. That is, after all, part of the purpose of this thread.

Likewise, propaganda is generally used to demonize its subject. As this is an Atheist counter-apologetics site, how would calling a group atheistic qualify as demonizing the subject? In this context, wouldn't it qualify as speaking well of them?

McIago wrote:IMHO this is "unChristian." It is also unscientific, for those who are not into religion.

I've never claimed to be a Christian, but as a ministerial candidate seeking ordination, I feel I can claim to be 'into religion'. This is an attempt to have the first bit of my research vetted, which does qualify as part of the scientific process.
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Halfway Christian

Postby dobbie » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:01 am

BunniRabbi wrote:
There are those who would argue one could be Christian and atheist, though there a distinct minority.

Web on what Christian Atheists are:
Most Christian atheists think of Jesus as a wise and good man, accepting his moral teachings but rejecting the idea of his divinity.

Most Christian atheists believe that God never existed, but there are a few who believe in the death of God literally
.

My imput: I say they should bill themselves as halfway Christians. At least the label goes further to help others understand in general. The label "Halfway Christian" doesn’t have the oxymoron sound of Christian Atheist.

For example a halfway Christian guy calls himself “a Christian (sort of).â€
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Re: Halfway Christian

Postby BunniRabbi » Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:27 pm

"Halfway Christian" carries a pejorative tone, and might be misunderstood as referring to convictions instead of cosmology/teleology.

Those who look to the Bible as metaphor are Augustinian Christians, as that was the teaching of St. Augustine. Augustinians are typically theistic however.

A closer term to what you're describing is a Jeffersonian Christian, as Thomas Jefferson advised as similar perspective. Some Jeffersonians would self-describe as deists however.

I wasn't aware of a major Atheistic Christian movement. Could you provide a link?
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Labels

Postby dobbie » Fri Mar 25, 2011 8:55 pm

BunniRabbi wrote:
I wasn't aware of a major Atheistic Christian movement. Could you provide a link?

I wasn't aware of a major Atheistic Christian movement, either. In fact the first time I heard the term Atheistic Christian was when you mentioned it.

I could only Google the topic and I got the following among a couple others:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_atheism

The deal is, the "religious" doctrine of the co-called Atheist Christian is confusing to the outsider. That's because it mainly sounds like yet another way of cherry picking the Bible. The way I see it, it's confusing to hear a Christian denomination teach that Jesus didn't rise from the dead. And its hard to see how it distinguishes itself from Unitarian or Confucian views. Or from ancient Chinese proverbs.
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Postby MAtheist » Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:36 pm

At the start of this thread, you said ...
It helps readers be more conversant on the subject of atheism, by clearing up misconceptions about the term 'atheist'.
From some of your other posts, I am not sure if your definition of atheist is the same as that held by many here, or the creators of the Iron Chariots wiki for that matter. I could be way off and may be proven wrong, but I have made a post on your terminology of belief thread.

I felt that was better that having many disjointed discussions on the topic, because as I see it many of the religions you are talking about would not be classified as atheistic, but may contain a large number of adherents that do not realize they are, by the most basic definition, atheists.
I don't "believe" in evolution, I understand evolution.
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